The soft wood lumber talks between Canada and the USA have just completely broken down. Although I personally knew this is the route is would go, Ide like to explain it to others who dont understand.

The end result is a 29 percent tariff now slapped onto lumber being exported into the states from Canada. This is Bushs' idea of free trade? While the US media isnt reporting the seriousness of this action ( further leading me to believe there IS an Illuminati ruled government AND media,as Icke and others think,)..Canada is doing so. Why? Because of this news,yesterday 2000 foresty workers were instantly handed their notices of the end of employment with the closure of 3 mills. This will eventually affect 30,000 in the area where I live,a reported "spin-off" of 140,000 jobs in Vancouver,and a total of 300,000 in Canada in whole with the "dominoe affect".

The truly disgusting part,is as this is going on,Bush is pumping up the wonderful free trade relationship with Mexico..a poor country who is obviously helping the rich get richer. Of course he would be pumping it up.

Its important for everyone to know what is REALLY going on,as this is having a serious affect with how Canadians are now viewing his policies,and they are slowly but surely opening their eyes to the secret agendas,including this so called war-on-terrorism.Canada is all of a sudden, not the "friend" the US would like to think. This is major news here.

The spin off which will affect the USA is this..your lumber prices will rise sky high,making it almost impossible to afford to build. Canada exports 75 percent of its lumber to the US. Now our mills our closing. Canadian citizens are demanding we stop sharing our resources such as water,gas and power now. You WONT be hearing this in the US.
What is happening here,is a true reflection of what will happen in other industries. Everyone should take note.

As benefits are starting to run out with some of these workers,who have now been off 6 months since the lumber dispute started,they are looking at either moving,or applying for welfare. At the same time this is going on,welfare rates are being lowered by the fiasco government here...again..the rich getting richer.

This is a precursor to a future truly dog-eat-dog world,where after the break out of WW3,along with huge natural disasters, SURVIVAL will be the issue...not a weekly paycheck.
Who will help their neighbour, when you wont be able to help yourself,and your own family.

Anyone getting the picture?

Take a look at this and maybe get the picture

I received this e-mail a few days ago.
*****************************
Perhaps we are asking the wrong questions during election years. Our Senators and Congressmen do not pay into Social Security and, of course, they do not collect from it. Social Security benefits were not suitable for persons of their rare elevation in society. They felt they should have a
special plan for themselves. Many years ago they voted in their own benefit plan. In more recent years, no congressperson has felt the need to change it. After all, it is a great plan.

For all practical purposes their plan works like this: When they retire, they continue to draw the same pay until they die,
except it may increase from time to time for cost of living adjustments. For example, former Senator Byrd and Congressman White
and their wives may expect to draw $7,800,000.00 (that's Seven Million,
Eight-Hundred Thousand), with their wives drawing $275,000.00 during the last years of their lives. This is calculated on an average life span for each.

Their cost for this excellent plan is $00.00.
Nada. Zilch. This little perk they voted for themselves is free to them. You and I pick up the tab for this plan. The funds for this fine retirement plan come directly from
the General Funds-our tax dollars at work! From our own Social Security Plan, which you and I pay (or have paid) into-every payday until we retire (which amount is matched by our employer)--we can expect to get an average $1,000 per month after
retirement. Or, in other words, we would have to collect our average of
$1,000. monthly benefits for 68 years and one (l)month to equal Bradley's
benefits!

Social Security could be very good if only one small change were made. And that change would be to jerk the Golden Fleece Retirement Plan from under the Senators and Congressmen. Put them into the Social Security plan with the rest of us and then watch how fast they would fix it.

If enough people read this, maybe a seed of
awareness will be planted.

Follow Your Heart
Pat

Dear Aries ~

we all know what bush wants....he wants votes for himself and his party. if this will help the lumber industry in the u.s. he will do it, without a second thought of breaking any international agreements. is this to help u.s. lumber workers, or u.s. lumber corporations? i would imagine it is designed to look like it's helping workers, while underhandedly making it possible for corporations to move their operations to a poor country where they don't have to follow any environmental or labor rules, in order for the corporations to make huge profits eventually with very low overhead. if this scenario is correct, he probably will pull it off right under the noses of u.s. workers, securing their votes, while also securing the votes of industry for future regulations allowing low cost imports from mexico. just my speculation.

i am sending all my love and apologies to all the canadian workers this has affected. i hope for a miracle to turn this around, and for them to find some better employment and/or relief from a more benevolent government or u.s. policy, or a completely new and workable solution. God be with you all.

and i have some further questions regarding this: you state that "...SURVIVAL will be the issue...not a weekly paycheck. Who will help their neighbour, when you won't be able to help yourself,and your own family." Many of your posts contain statements such as this, pertaining to your knowledge (from prophecy?) or beliefs about the future of our world and what to expect.

if you truly believe this is our future, you must have some kind of preparation in mind, either for yourself, or at least for some others with whom you discuss these things who plan to be around to survive in this difficult new world. this may sound naive on my part, but i really would like to know what some of the solutions, or preparations are that people may be planning.

i mean, i think you would suggest preparing your heart and securing your relationship with your higher power, reading scripture, and praying/meditating, but i wold like to know also if you have any resources for the physical day to day survival.

what will conscientious people like you be doing? assuming one refuses to be microchipped, how will one survive? do you have any knowledge of specific directions or plans to be following? i know of some people who keep emergency supplies on hand, canned goods, generators, gallons of water, maybe even a mountain cabin, etc., but are there other alternatives, communities, and such? are people getting together and planning out these kinds of things? is it too hush hush and dangerous to discuss openly on a site like this?

please fill me in! i listen seriously to what you have to say, but it always leaves me hanging with this big question...what should i do to prepare for this? or should i just pray and meditate and wait to be led to the slaughter, die in the wilderness or sell my soul?

are these questions dumb? i really would appreciate your help! it makes me feel so silly to be ordering diapers and pondering whether my children will be vegetarians, if in reality, we won't even be able to eat or bathe in this bleak future. is there something more appropriate to which to direct my thoughts and activities? i would love to know!

thanks and much love from snowpea

hi snow..its to help the money hungry CEOS and corporations,and the future New World disorder with little concern for the "little guy"...but as usual,is hidden in secret agendas.
It wont help workers in the US,if it does,it will be temporary.. it will drive your lumber prices sky high. Im not sure if the US has a lot of forests to wipe out.I dont really cotton to deforestation anyway,so I can understand a bigger picture here,where Im sure all is meant to be one way or the other.

no need to worry,as everyone will change into "5th dimensional light beings" and will escape the upcoming fiasco...(kidding of course)

Yes,turning to spiritual will help.
You seem to have a good handle on all this. Ive sent you a PM.
In the end,Im sure its all a part of our evolution, so not to worry. My concern is what people dont know,and what they will have a hard time handling.

hi Pat..I highly doubt you will see any social security..I think they will take that away to you know..fight "terrorism"
Put your money to work now,to prepare in other ways...unless you are old enough to be able to see some of it.

Here in BC, this fiasco of a government has dropped the mimimum wage. Me thinks Premier Gordolina needs his wage lowered,..AND his pension taken away.
(terri,stop laughing..that his new name now!)

GET OUT OF MY HEAD!!!

And I'm warning you - with Mars and Venus conj. in my progressed chart and about to be trined by Uranus...if you don't get out of my head soon you are going to see things that I just don't think you will be able to handle!

T

hehe bring it on....

Hi Aries

I appreciate your comments.. although I don't depend on social security nor have I ever believed in it.

But more importantly, it is for those who are dependent upon social security, expecting to be, and those who believe it is a fair and justifiable return of investment.

Follow Your Heart
Pat

Okay guys, this is a looong one, but there's a LOT of information here. This is a transcript of an interview of Greg Palast, Journalist for BBC and Observer, London, by Alex Jones on the Alex Jones Radio Show, Monday, March 4, 2002
_______________________________

AJ: This is earth shattering. Can you break it down for us and tell us what the economists have done?

GP: Well, I'll tell you two things. One, I spoke to the former chief economist, Joe Stiglitz who was fired by the (World) Bank. So I, on BBC and with Guardian, basically spent some time debriefing him. It was like one of the scenes out of Mission Impossible, you know where the guy comes over from the other side and you spend hours debriefing him. So I got the insight of what was happening at the World Bank. In addition, he did not brief me but I got some other sources. He would not give me inside documents but other people handed me a giant stash of secret documents from the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund.

AJ: So to insulate himself, somebody else did it.

GP: No, I'm telling you. He wouldn't touch it but I really did get from completely independent sources a big stack of documents.

AJ: Just like you got W199I, from the same folks we got it from.

GP: And so one of the things that is happening is that, in fact, I was supposed to be on CNN with the head of the World Bank Jim Wolfensen and he said he would not appear on CNN ever if they put me on. And so CNN did the craziest thing and pulled me off.

AJ: So now they are threatening total boycott.

GP: Yea right. So what we found was this. We found inside these documents that basically they required nations to sign secret agreements, in which they agreed to sell off their key assets, in which they agreed to take economic steps which are really devastating to the nations involved and if they didn't agree to these steps, there was an average for each nation that signed one-hundred and eleven items that they are required to sign on to. If they didn't follow those steps they would be cut-off from all international borrowing. You can't borrow any money in the international marketplace. No one can survive without borrowing, whether you are people or corporations or countries - without borrowing some money and having some credit and ...

AJ: Because of the debt inflation pit they've created.

GP: Yea, well, see one of the things that happened is that - we've got examples from, I've got inside documents recently from Argentina, the secret Argentine plan. This is signed by Jim Wolfensen, the president of the World Bank. By the way, just so you know, they are really upset with me that I've got the documents, but they have not challenged the authenticity of the documents. First, they did. First they said those documents don't exist. I actually showed them on television. And cite some on the web, I actually have copies of some...

AJ: Greg Palast dot com?

GP: Yea, gregpalast.com. So then they backed off and said yea those documents are authentic but we are not going to discuss them with you and we are going to keep you off the air anyway. So, that's that. But what they were saying is look, you take a country like Argentina, which is, you know, in flames now. And it has had five presidents in five weeks because their economy is completely destroyed.

AJ: Isn't it six now?

GP: Yea, it's like the weekly president because they can't hold the nation together. And this happened because they started out in the end of the 80s with orders from the IMF and World Bank to sell-off all their assets, public assets. I mean, things we wouldn't think of doing in the US, like selling off their water system.

AJ: So they tax the people. They create big government and big government hands it off to the private IMF/World Bank. And when we get back, I want to get to the four-parts that you elegantly lay out here where they actually pay off the politicians billions to their Swiss bank accounts to do this transfer.

GP: That's right.

AJ: This is like one of the biggest stories ever, Sir. I'm sorry, please continue.

GP: So what's happening is - this is just one of them. And by the way, it's not just anyone who gets a piece of the action. The water system of Buenos Aires was sold off for a song to a company called ENRON. A pipeline was sold off, that runs between Argentina and Chile, was sold off to a company called ENRON.

AJ: And then the globalists blow out the Enron AFTER TRANSFERRING THE ASSETS TO ANOTHER DUMMY CORPORATION and then they just roll the theft items off.

GP: You've got it. And by the way, you know why they moved the pipeline to Enron is that they GOT A CALL FROM SOMEBODY NAMED GEORGE W. BUSH IN 1988.

AJ: Unbelievable, Sir. Stay right there. We are talking to Greg Palast.

BREAK

AJ: We are talking to Greg Palast. He is an award-winning journalist, an American who has worked for the BBC, London Guardian, you name it, who has dropped just a massive bomb-shell on the GLOBALISTS and THEIR CRIMINAL ACTIVITY. There is no other word for it. You link through at http://www.inforwars.com , you can link to his web site - http://www.gregpalast.com , or any of the other great reports he has been putting out. He now has the secret documents. We have seen the activity of the IMF/World Bank for years. They come in, pay off politicians to transfer the water systems, the railways, the telephone companies, the nationalized oil companies, gas stations - they then hand it over to them for nothing. The GLOBALISTS PAY THEM OFF individually, billions a piece in Swiss bank accounts. And THE PLAN IS TOTAL SLAVERY FOR THE ENTIRE POPULATION. Of course, ENRON, as we told you was a dummy corporation for money laundering, drug money, you name it, from the other reporters we have had on. It's just incredibly massive and hard to believe. But it is actually happening. Greg Palast has now broken the story world-wide. He has actually interviewed the former top World Bank economist. Continuing Sir with all these points. I mean for the average person out there, in a nutshell, what is the system you are exposing?

GP: We are exposing that THEY are SYSTEMATICALLY TEARING NATIONS APART, whether it's Ecuador or Argentina. The PROBLEM is some of these bad ideas are DRIFTING back INTO THE U.S. In other words, they have run out of places to bleed. And the problem is, this is the chief economist, this is not some minor guy. By the way, a couple of months ago, after he was fired, he was given the Nobel Prize in Economics. So he is no fool. He told me, he went into countries where they were talking about privatizing and selling off these assets. And basically, they knew, they literally knew and turned the other way when it was understood that LEADERS of these countries and the CHIEF MINISTERS would SALT AWAY HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS.

AJ: But it's not even privatization. They just steal it from the people and hand it over to the IMF/World Bank.

GP: They hand it over, generally to the cronies, like CITIBANK was very big and grabbed half the Argentine banks. You've got British Petroleum grabbing pipelines in Ecuador. I mentioned Enron grabbing water systems all over the place. And the problem is that they are destroying these systems as well. You can't even get drinking water in Buenos Aires. I mean it is not just a question of the theft. You can't turn on the tap. It is more than someone getting rich at the public expense.

AJ: And the IMF just got handed the Great Lakes. They have the sole control over the water supply now. That's been in the Chicago Tribune.

GP: Well the problem that we have is - look, the IMF and the World Bank is 51% owned by the United States Treasury. So the question becomes, what are we getting for the money that we put into there? And it looks like we are getting mayhem in several nations. Indonesia is in flames. He was telling me, the Chief Economist, Stiglitz, was telling me that he started questioning what was happening. You know, everywhere we go, every country we end up meddling in, we destroy their economy and they end up in flames. And he was saying that he questioned this and he got fired for it. But he was saying that they even kind of PLAN in THE RIOTS. They know that when they squeeze a country and destroy its economy, you are going to get riots in the streets. And they say, well that's the IMF riot. In other words, because you have riot, you lose. All the capital runs away from your country and that gives the opportunity for the IMF to then add more conditions.

AJ: And that makes them even more desperate. So it is really an imperial economy war to implode countries and now THEY are DOING it HERE with ENRON. They are getting SO GREEDY - they are PREPARING IT FOR THIS COUNTRY [U.S.].

GP: I've just been talking to, out in California just yesterday, from here in Paris, the chief investigators of Enron for the State of California. They are telling me some of the games these guys are playing. No one is watching that. It's not just the stockholders that got ripped off. THEY SUCKED MILLIONS, BILLIONS OF DOLLARS OUT OF THE PUBLIC pocket in TEXAS AND CALIFORNIA in particular.

AJ: Where are the assets? See, everybody says there are no assets left since Enron was a dummy corporation - from the experts I've had on and they transferred all those assets to other corporations and banks.

GP: Well yea, this stuff has really gone just like a three-card Monty game. I mean remember that there is money at the bottom. You did pay California's electric bills according to the investigations, they are telling me that they were pumped up unnecessarily by 9 to 12 billion dollars. And I don't know who they are going to get it back from now.

AJ: Well they actually caught the GOVERNOR BUYING it for $137 PER MEGAWATT and SELLING IT BACK TO ENRON for $1 PER MEGAWATT and doing it over and over and over again.

GP: Yea, the system has gotten completely out of control and these guys knew exactly what was happening. Well, you have to understand that some of the guys who designed the system in California for deregulation then went to work for Enron right after. In fact, here I'm in London right now and we have, the British has some responsibility here. The guy who was on the audit committee of Enron, Lord Wakeham. And this guy is a real piece of work, there isn't a conflict of interest that he hasn't been involved in.

AJ: And he is the head of NM Rothschild.

GP: There isn't anything that he doesn't have his fingers in. He's on something like fifty Boards. And one of the problems, he was supposed to be head of the audit committee watching how Enron kept the books. And in fact, they were paying him consulting fees on the side. He was in Margaret Thatcher's government and he's the one who authorized Enron to come into Britain and take over power plants here in Britain. And they owned a water system in the middle of England. This is what this guy approved and then they gave him a job on the board. And on top of being on the board, they gave him a huge consulting contract. So you know, this guy was supposed to be in charge of the audit committee to see how they were handling their accounts.

AJ: Well, he is also the head of the board to regulate the media.

GP: Yes, he is, because I have run into real problems, because he regulates me.

AJ: They are also trying to pass laws in England where you've got an 800-year old well, or in some cases a 2000-year old well that the Romans built that's on your property and they say we are putting a meter on it. You can't have your own water.

GP: Yea, and that's Lord Wakeham. I mean this is the guy from Enron. He is a real piece of work. He can't be touched here because like I say he actually regulates the media. So if you complain, he's got his hand on your pen.

AJ: Burrow into NM Rothschild, you'll find it all there. Go through these four points. I mean you've got the documents. The IMF/World Bank implosion, four points, how they bring down a country and destroy the resources of the people.

GP: Right. First you open up the capital markets. That is, you sell off your local banks to foreign banks. Then you go to what's called market-based pricing. That's the stuff like in California where everything is free market and you end up with water bills - we can't even imagine selling off water companies in the United States of America. But imagine if a private company like Enron owned your water. So then the prices go through the roof. Then open up your borders to trade - complete free marketeering. And Stiglitz who was the chief economist, remember he was running this system, he was their numbers man and he was saying it was like the opium wars. He said this ISN'T FREE TRADE; this IS COERCION TRADE. THIS IS WAR. They are taking apart economies through this.

AJ: Well look, China has a 40% tariff on us, we have a 2% on them. That's not free and fair trade. It's to FORCE ALL INDUSTRY to a COUNTRY that the GLOBALISTS FULLY CONTROL.

GP: Well, you know Walmart - I did a story, in fact, if you read my book. Let me just mention that I've got a book out, "The Best Democracy Money Can Buy" about how, unfortunately, America has been put up for sale. "The Best Democracy Money Can Buy" is coming out this week. But I have a story in there about how Walmart has 700 plants in China. There is almost nothing in a Walmart store that comes from the United States of America, despite all the eagles on the wall.

AJ: Exactly, like 1984, then they have big flags saying "Buy American" and there's hardly anything --- it's Orwellian double-think.

GP: What's even worst is they will hire a factory and right next to it will be the sister factory which is inside a prison. You can imagine the conditions of these workers producing this lovely stuff for Walmart. It's really....

AJ: And if an elitist needs a liver, they just call.

GP: (Laughs) I know, it's grim. In fact, I talked to a guy, Harry Wu, is his name and, in fact, he broke into, he's been in Chinese prison for 19 years. No one believed his horrible stories. He actually broke back into prison, took a camera with him and took pictures of the conditions and said this is the conditions of factories where Walmart is getting its stuff made at, it's all....

AJ: I was threatened to be thrown off TV here in Austin when I aired video of little girls 4-years old chained down, skinnier than Jews in concentration camps, to die. And I was threatened, if you ever air that again, you will be arrested.

GP: Well you know, it is horrifying stuff that, unfortunately, I have been handed and Stiglitz, was very courageous for him to come out and make these statements. Like I said, he didn't provide me the documents. The documents really sealed it because it said this is what really happened. They really do say sign on the dotted line agreeing to 111 conditions for each nation. And the public has no say; they don't know what the hell is happening to them. All they know....

AJ: Go back into privatization. Go through these four points. That's the key. It sends billions to politicians to hand everything over.

GP: Yea, he called it briberization, which is you sell off the water company and that's worth, over ten years, let's say that that's worth about 5 billion bucks, ten percent of that is 500 million, you can figure out how it works. I actually spoke to a Senator from Argentina two weeks ago. I got him on camera. He said that AFTER HE GOT A CALL FROM GEORGE W. BUSH in 1988 saying GIVE the gas PIPELINE in Argentina TO ENRON, that's our CURRENT PRESIDENT. He said that what he found was really creepy was that ENRON was going to pay one-fifth of the world's price for their gas and he said how can you make such an offer? And he was told, not by George W. but by a partner in the deal, well if we only pay one-fifth that leaves quit a little bit for you to go in your Swiss bank account. And that's how it's done.

AJ: This is the ....

GP: I've got the film. This guy is very conservative. He knows the Bush family very well. And he was public works administrator in Argentina and he said, yea, I got this call. I asked him, I said, from George W. Bush. He said, yea, November 1988, the guy called him up and said give a pipeline to Enron. Now this is the SAME GEORGE W. BUSH who said he DIDN'T get to KNOW KEN LAY UNTIL 1994. So, you know.....

AJ: So now they are having these white-wash hearings. You know I was at Enron yesterday in Houston because I'm now here in Austin. We were like 30-feet from the door, right on the sidewalk and I have it on video - goons came up and said you can't videotape. I said go ahead and have me arrested. I mean I'm talking on the sidewalk, Greg.

GP: Well, you know, I was there in May, telling people in Britain you've never heard of Enron, but ... And these are the guys who have figured out how to (garbled) this government. In fact, we saw some interesting documents, a month before Bush took office, Bill Clinton, I think to get even with Bush's big donor, cut Enron out of the California power market. He put a cap on the prices they could charge. They COULDN'T CHARGE MORE than ONE-HUNDRED TIMES the NORMAL PRICE for ELECTRICITY. THAT UPSET ENRON. So Ken Lay personally wrote a note to Dick Cheney saying get rid of Clinton's cap on prices. Within 48 hours of George W. Bush taking office, his energy department reversed the clamps on Enron. OK, how much is that worth for those guys. You know that has got to be worth, that paid off in a week all the donations.

AJ: Listen at the bombs you are dropping. You are interviewing these ministers, former head of IMF/World Bank economist - all of this, you've got the documents, paying people's Swiss Bank accounts, all this happening. Then you've got Part 2, what do they do after they start imploding?

GP: Well, then they tell you to start cutting your budgets. A fifth of the population of Argentina is unemployed, and they said cut the unemployment benefits drastically, take away pension funds, cut the education budgets, I mean horrible things. Now if you cut the economy in the middle of a recession that was created by these guys, you are really going to ABSOLUTELY DEMOLISH this nation. After we were attacked on September 11, Bush ran out and said we got to spend $50 to $100 billion dollars to save our economy. We don't start cutting the budget, you start trying to save this economy. But they TELL THESE COUNTRIES YOU'VE GOT TO CUT, and CUT, and CUT. And why, according to the inside documents, it's so you can MAKE PAYMENTS to FOREIGN BANKS - the FOREIGN BANKS are COLLECTING 21% to 70% INTEREST. This is LOAN-SHARKING. If fact, it was so bad that they required Argentina to get rid of the laws against loan-sharking because any bank would be a loan-shark under Argentine law.

AJ: But Greg, you said it yourself and the documents show it. They first implode the economy to create that atmosphere. They institute the entire climate that does this.

GP: Yea, and then they say, well gee, we can't lend you any money except at these loan-shark rates. We don't allow people to charge 75% interest in the United States. That's loan-sharking.

AJ: Part 3 and Part 4. What do they do after they do that?

GP: Like I said, you open up the borders for trade, that's the new opium wars. And once you have destroyed an economy that can't produce anything, one of the terrible things is that they are forcing nations to pay horrendous amounts for things like drugs - legal drugs. And by the way, that's how you end up with an illegal drug trade, what's there left to survive on except sell us smack and crack and that's how...

AJ: And the same CIA national security dictatorship has been caught shipping that in.

GP: You know, we are just helping our allies.

AJ: This is just amazing. And so, drive the whole world down, blow out their economies and then buy the rest of it up for pennies on the dollar. What's Part 4 of the IMF/World Bank Plan?

GP: Well, in Part 4, you end up again with the taking apart of the government. And by the way, the real PART 4 is the COUP D'ETAT. That's what they are not telling you. And I'm just finding that out in Venezuela. I just got a call from the President of Venezuela.

AJ: And they install their own corporate government.

GP: What they said was here you've got an elected president of the government and the IMF has announced, listen to this, that they would support a transition government if the president were removed. They are not saying that they are going to get involved in politics - they would just support a transition government. What that effectively is saying is we will pay for the coup d'etat, if the military overthrows the current president, because the current president of Venezuela has said no to the IMF. He told those guys to go packing. They brought their teams in and said you have to do this and that. And he said, I don't have to do nothing. He said what I'm going to do is, I'm going to double the taxes on oil corporations because we have a whole lot of oil in Venezuela. And I'm going to double the taxes on oil corporations and then I will have all the money I need for social programs and the government - and we will be a very rich nation. Well, as soon as they did that, THEY STARTED FOMENTING TROUBLE WITH THE MILITARY and I'm telling you watch this space: the President of Venezuela will be out of office in three months or shot dead. They are not going to allow him to raise taxes on the oil companies.

AJ: Greg Palast, here is the problem. You said it when you first came out of the gates. They are getting hungry, THEY ARE DOING IT TO THE UNITED STATES NOW. Enron, from all the evidence that I've seen was a front, another shill, they would steal assets and then transfer it to other older global companies, then they blew that out and stole the pension funds. Now they are telling us that terrorism is coming any day. It's going to happen if you don't give your rights up. Bush did not involve Congress and the others who are supposed to be in the accession if there is a nuclear attack in the secret government, Washington Post -"Congress Not Advised of Shadow Government." We have the Speaker of the House not being told. This looks like coup d'etat here. I'm going to come right out with it. We had better spread the word on this now or these greedy creatures are going to go all the way.

GP: I'm very sad about one thing. I report this story in the main stream press of Britian. I'm on the BBC despite Lord Wakeham. I know he doesn't like me there. I'm in the BBC, I'm in the main daily paper, which is the equivalent of the New York Times or whatever, and we do get the information out. And I'm just very sorry that we have to have an alternative press, an alternative radio network and everything else to get out the information that makes any sense. I mean this information should be available to every American. I mean, after all, it's our government.

Love,
Greg

That's pretty serious stuff Greg!

Love,
Terri

Gee Whilakerrs...*sigh*...

Once again, I sent this webpage to my son Stephen (history/political science major in college), and he appreciated it....but he did say he had already seeen Greg's post on the Jeff Rense site, so was familiar with it...*sigh*...he's pretty much aware of all of this, and I did ask him if he could participate in our discussions....As much as he would like to...he had to decline due to his very busy work schedule...I think it was Pat who suggested that he might want to participate...*sigh*...If he gets time for a movie like "Oh Brother, Where Art Thou?" I'm happy for him...the guy deserves it....Nice diversion...

Love,
Rainbow~

Oi Veh.

I must be the most naive thing on two legs....this kind of dishonesty would never...I mean never occur to me....

How could we let this happen?....You can't even vote them out...we saw from the last election that our vote does not really count....considering all of the counts for which they could not account.

ttttthhhpt!

Have any of you ever gone to Washington DC and just stood at the foot of the Lincoln Memorial and LOOked at him?...Really LOOked?
LOOked at those eyes looking down at you from his chair?

Honest Abe.

This would make him cry.

It's not what our country was supposed to be for........

Love and peace,

Dani

Greg....did you notice he said "111 conditions" ?

Is that a number he just threw out for example?...Or is it really 111 conditions?

I couldn't help but wonder.....

Love,

Dani

Yes, I did notice that Dani.

Who knows? That's part f the danger when you start getting involved in really looking at this stuff, is that all sorts of weird synchronicities and foreshadowings and symbolisms start to emerge, and it can make you paranoid. That's why so many conspiracy researchers have been dismissed as paranoid kooks, because this kind of stuff starts getting to them and before you know it they are postulating all sorts of bizarre scenarios and they DO come off looking like unbalanced nut cases, which makes EVERYTHING they have to say "dismissible."

Makes me wonder how much of this is intentional. It's really hard to say.

Love,
Greg

Well Greg...I'll tell you what my old Psych Prof used to say.....:

"Just because you are paranoid doesn't mean they are NOT out to get you!"

....Now back in the 70ties......I would ponder that for hours........ ...whahaha...but the air around me was thicker then.....

Today...well the plot thins, eh?

Do you think Pluto being Rx this time thru the opp....the change will happen?

They can't get by with this stuff anymore right?...Because they never anticipated Bill Gates, right?

You tell me,...I tell a few friends and they tell a few friends...and it's a hell of a lot more efficient than the pony express....the world is too small......
They can't shut up everyone, right?

Too many computers to keep track of.... right?

Right?

*sigh*....right!....ttthhhpt!

Love,

Dani

Hey Dani -

Now you just said soemthing that feeds intop my own paranoia....what if 'they' decided too much information is being made availble against them on line, that too many groups of people are coming together in this way (and it's happening - thank god! )....so they let a 'terrorist' put a bad-a** virus on the web and for 'security' reasons have to shut the whole WWW down, and sites will have to apply for re-instatement from some central web-authorization authority.

OK - hopefully that's just sign I am spending WAY too much time thinking on this!!! I have got to a bit....

On a different note - does anyone else listen to the Art Bell radio show? I have off and on for a couple years. Lately I have listed to a bit almost every night. He ties it all together in an intersting way...though my gut says he's a little too paranoid too....but geez, how can you not be?

Love,
Terri

Terri,we dont get Art Bell here,but I know about him and his show. He puts the info "out there".

Now,about this web thing...I wouldnt be surprised...
And thats not being paranoid at all!

Terri, don't think for a moment that they wouldn't do exactly that if they could ... and we surely WILL see some attempts to control and regulate it and shut down "treasonous" sites and so on. But the wonderful thing about the internet is that it was originally invented by the best military minds on the planet, with the specific design objective of being so thoroughly distributed and self-rebuilding that it was essentially invulnerable to disruption. And the supreme irony of that is that it eventually migrated out of the military sphere and into the public domain, but it's still what the military intended it to be: basically invulnerable. There's no place to switch it off!

The internet has the establishment worried silly, believe it! That's exactly why I think that this forum and other avenues of free spiritual thought on the net are so important at this point on the world stage. With mass-media like TV, all you have to do is control the networks and you can completely control what people see and hear ... but not so with the net. This is the mass-media of the people.

Love,
Greg

We ain't daid yet.

Dani, my soul thanks you ever much for being around posting again. Be Here Now, heehee.

Maria

Why Maria!!!! What a sweet thing to say!

Don't you fret and don't you frown...I never left....I just had nothing to say for a while.... ...and YES that IS possible!!!!

LOL...I imagine I can make up for lost time without too much trouble....maybe some finger cramps...but not too much trouble!

Greg...isn't it ironic?...My very own system was built by my Saggie computer guru...himself a 25 yr vet.....he was there when Saigon fell...he was one of the asses we left hanging in the rice patties when LBJ stopped the bombing under civilian politcal pressure.....

He is an absolute patriot...with his eyes wide open.

It was HE that insisted my family go on-line...(I did not know what I was missing...neither did Mark)...it is he who protects my system and teaches me how to use it.

It is because of this very same Vietnam vet...that I am here to learn and Love and share with you all...all of our fears and blessings.
It's because of him...that we met! insert a million hearts here>

He was at my side the very first time I logged on here...and watched me burst into tears of joy at finding this place!!!!

When you look at the military...it's a gigantic war machine...but the thing is...they need the action figures that go with it...and thats the guys, out there now...building computers for people like me.

Never piss off the action figures.

Oh yeah...they'd try to shut us down in a second...but somewhere in someones basement...someone would be building another one.

The horse is out of the barn now...there's no going back...so we all have to keep talking and sharing...as much as we can...and if we get cut off...we have to fight to find each other again...and talk some more.

Aries' message to us about the forests in Canada is a perfect example.....I have not heard a thing about it here..(Had you?)..and Michigan is logging country too...in fact I have a lot of friends in construction...and you can bet your sweet bippy I will be telling them what she wrote.

One thing really cool about working with the public......I can spread news like a rag mag.....

Think of it...how long will it be before someone in Afghanistan logs on somewhere...and talks to people in the rest of the world?

*Jeopardy theme song* teeheeee.....

Love,

Dani

Greg, what I do wonder after reading what your post, and all other posts for that matter, is how on earth can this be changed?? What can we do?? Start an underground terrorist organisation?? Infiltrate the Swiss bank and steal their money?? I don't know.

And about controlling the net and Bill Gates... Well, sooner or later Bill Gates WILL control the whole computer software market, and that's a pretty nice thing, for him. And other that might push him into doing stuff with this control.

What strikes me is the complexity of the worlds financial structure, infrastructure and well, all other structure else for that matter. How much control do we really have over our money, our income, our communication line, our source of getting lifeneeding stuff?? The world today is so complex that when you start thinking how to change something bad that is going on, your mind starts complaining and wants to think of something easy instead, like the meaning of life, how the universe works and japaneese. It's really weird how we have gotten to the point where the one with most money wins. And what's even more weird is that money, in itself, is nothing.

Lorsa, what you just said may well be one of the most profound statements ever made about the state we're in:

quote:

---

It's really weird how we have gotten to the point where the one with most money wins. And what's even more weird is that money, in itself, is nothing.

---

Exactly! We have gotten to the point where the ultimate power on the planet is something that is "really" nothing ... just a symbol. Once upon a time, money was something real -- precious metals or herds of cattle, or other tangible assets of real value that really existed, and the printed money was just a "receipt" signifying ownership of those real assets. But the bankers have done a splendid job over the centuries of disconnecting money from its real roots, so that now it is not anything real at all just pieces of paper and entries in ledgers or computers that signify abstract agreements.

In a word (or actually in six words), that's how they stole the world! By changing the nature of money from something concrete to something purely abstract, governed by principles so arcane and abstract that even Ph.D. economists can't fully comprehend it, and making themselves (the bankers) the repository and "guardian" of those abstract symbols, they created a situation whereby they could siphon it off to themselves by means of clever manipulation rather than productive work ... and in far greater amounts than productive work could ever produce!

Today the combined worth of the Rothschilds and Rockefellers is upwards of six trillion dollars! That's far more than the treasury of any nation on earth ... which is why they can essentially "buy and sell" governments like they were Monopoly pieces. This is by far the cleverest criminal scam ever devised by the human mind!

I understand your inclination to think along the lines of fighting fire with fire by terrorism or theft. But that can never work, because it involves "buying into" the great deception that these master manipulators have woven. If we use force ourselves "they" will always win (just as "they" have won every major war, regardless of what history says ... the people and the nations are always devastated by war - even on the "winning" side - but the bankers and their power structure ALWAYS emerge from every war richer and more powerful than before.)
I believe that the answer to the question "what can we do about it?" involves changing our minds about our willingness to support their deceptions. I realize that's much easier said than done, but I believe the first step is to spread the Truth about how the world is really controlled as widely as possible, and growing to understand it ourselves on the very deepest and most fundamental levels. When people KNOW - not just on a theoretical level, but on a direct practical level as rock-solid knowledge - what is going on, then we will be in a position to say "we aren't playing any more." And then their game will be up, because it's all a house of cards built on our willingness to play by their rules and believe in their fantasies. On a level playing ground, against a world population that is no longer hypnotized into playing by their rules, their power is no more real than their money.

So in a very practical sense, the most powerful action each of us can take toward freedom from this bondage is to change our minds in several important ways:

• Most important, stop believing in the necessity of fighting each other, and start believing in the necessity of loving and cooperating with each other.
• Learn the Truth about the power structure of the world, and spread that awareness as far and as wide as you can, to everyone. Keep learning and keep communicating, and don't let up.
• Finally, when a critical mass is achieved in both of the areas above, join together with others around the world and say, "we quit. We don't believe in your wars anymore, and we don't believe in your money any more, and we're not playing your game any more."

And that's that. The powers that be have no answer to our unwillingness to keep playing their game. Stripped of the power of our belief in their illusions, they are no more than a tiny group of sad old men who have no power whatsoever to stand against the world. The only power they have is the power we give them through our belief in their illusions.

Forgive me for quoting yet another Jewel song, but this line from A Life Uncommon sums it up perfectly:

"No longer lend your strength
To that which you wish to be free from."

Love,
Greg

PS - With regard to Bill Gates, I think he's actually a force for freedom in the world, rather than control. Not that he's a perfect human being by any means, but he does stand strongly for freedom on the internet, which is exactly why he is painted as a monopolistic dictator by the government, and why they have gone to such great lengths to cut him down to size. Had they succeeded in breaking him and gaining government control over the software industry as they had planned, we'd all be in a lot worse shape than we are now. And they'll keep trying, in different ways, of course. -G.

Wonderful Greg!!!!

BTW...I LOve Bill Gates....and I hope he scares the hell out of them..... He makes me grin when I see him on TV...because he is not pretentious at all...he always looks like he slept in his clothes you know?

He has given us all a great gift.

Love,

Dani

Gregory, I already know what you was going to answer me about what to do about it, simply becuase I found it all out by myself just before I read the post. But a world-wide enlightenment will indeed take time, and before we have completed our task, several millions of people will have died because of what "they" do. I wonder if "they" really know why they are doing like they do. I don't think they are...

And I'll just have to trust you on Bill G

Hi

Wonderful thoughts and ideas from everyone As usual.

Another 'paranoid' thought based on a documentary I saw last night on a Canadaian PBS station....

Now this one involves the WTC and 9-11 and might be hard for some people to hear. And I want to stress that I don't necessiarly belive it - I haven't in fact decided if these three things are 'co-incidence' or really part of something tht would be so evil that I feel dirty for just having thought of it.

Ok, the documentary mentioned 3 things about the WTC that I never knew:

1) The unique design of the building invloves a steel latice work that makes what amounts to a woven mesh cage that supports the structure from the outside. In a typical building the support comes from the core and then heavy steel beams radiate out from that to become the floor supports etc. The floors in the WTC were floating panels supported not by heavy cross beams, but by angle-iron. Still structurally sound, but perhaps not quite as heavy-duty as other methods.

2) The WTC was constructed as a project by the New York Port Authority, which I guess is like a city-level governing body. Because it was done under their authority it did not have to pass fire-saftey inspections in the same way other buildings do. In fact, it didn't even have a sprinkler system!?!?! Instead they put double-thickness masonry on the walls, which would provide an extra fire-rating, truw, but also made each floor that much heavier than average, resting on slightly weaker than average floors. Now would a sprinkler system have made any difference from the thousands of gallons of jet fuel? Probably not, but still.... also the severely debilitating dust and air-borne particles that have ruined the lungs of so many New Yorkers, esp. firefighters and emergency service workers was made much worse by the extra masonry.

3) Much of the funding for the WTC was put up by one of the Rockerfeller family.

Those three facts sit in my stomach in a very uneasy way.

Very uneasy.

Love,
Terri

Terri,as John of Patmos(revelation) said..chapter 17 & 18.."come here, I will show you the judgement of the great harlot,who sits on many waters, ..with whom the kings of the earth committed acts of immorality,and those who dwell on the earth were made drunk with her immorality.
For God has put it in their hearts,to execute his purpose by having a common purpose, and by giving their kingdom to the beast. And the kings of the earth, who committed acts of immorality and lived sensuously with her, will weep and lament over her when they see the smoke of her burning. For in one hour,your judgement has come"

Terri, there was an article in a magazine here, I did not read it all that carefully but I think it said that the WTC was a very good built building, and what made it fall was the heat. I am not sure, but I think it alse mentioned that WTC was built to survive numerous of catastrophes, except a plance crash...

Hi Terri ~ Aries

Your 'uneasyness' seems justifiable to me. Have you seen this website? Of the two links... first one is the original article.. the second one responds to comments generated by the article. WTC Law of Physics Suspended

The diagrams of the inner construction of the WTC are quite interesting.. and the concept of design is discussed.. plus the heat factor.

Granted.. the article is long... as the author admits.. some links have vanished and he is attempting to replace them, but over all it adds one more perspective to consider.
It's a whole lot more than what has been given in the media. That is no more than a repetitious enactment of poor scripting delivered by Hollywood clones. Whooops .. did I say that Hmmmm... there must be a 'Typetriloquist' in the room. That's someone who can throw their weight on the Keys while you type.

Follow Your Heart
Pat

This is something right out of the "bizarre" category...
We have close to 30,000 forestry workers about to lose jobs,and our government(starting tomorrow) is allowing bars to stay open til 4AM..and the sale of hard liquor in beer and wine stores..something never allowed durying the best of economic years..

...alcohol abuse---> more family violence..less money for paying the bills...WHO really IS in control of things around here???

Aries....

I talked to one of my construction friends about the lumber industry in Canada...and he said the US gov did it on purpose because the USA's lumber industry was hurting so bad.

Canada's lumber was priced low enough that the USA companies could not compete...because it costs more to produce here than there...(environmental rules and such---although I think they are lax)...so that goes right back to the name of this thread eh?....no...it's not free trade if you can raise the price of someone elses stuff to drive up the value of your own.....anyone smell Enron?

Also...about the new hours in the bars......after 9/11....alcohol consumption in the USA went up 26%....domestic assault..up 24%.....oh yeah...so it's a brilliant time to let people stay in the bars late... ...I mean it's not like they'll have to go to work right?

You're right...it's not fair...and you've got to wonder who's thinking all these great solutions up.

Does Canada tax liquor as hard as the USA does?...down here...when people drink...the government makes lots of money.....

Take care.......

~Dani

What awful stats, Dani, about drinking and domestic violence in the wake of 9/11. The whole world is on a Pluto binge. The Mideast stuff is spiraling harder than ever. Tough times to love your way through, eh?

Plenty of stuff to pray over. Canadian lumber families, stressed-out and suffering Americans, and two branches of the human family blowing each other up harder and harder in a land of holy history for three branches of the family.

Really tough and disheartening.

A lawyer friend gave me her extra copy of the Pluto special edition of the Mountain Astrologer. I started it, but it's huge. Going to take me awhile. Have you seen it?

What if that "It's All One God" idea caught on?

Love,
Maria

hi Dani and WriteOn..

Yes,Im familar with the secret agenda of the USA and the lumber crises,and Free Trade in general,as Ive been involved in this "battle" with labour vs. government for the last 5 years or so..(longer,but this was when the secret agenda really came to the forefront,the amount of jobs to be lost,businesses moving to Mexico in order to hire very cheap labour, farces such as new pollution laws,which will be dealt with by internal government "kangaroo courts" etc,etc).
2005 is when all hell really breaks loose.

Now,citizens,and unions are demanding hydro,water,fish,etc have these same tariffs imposed on products we export to the US. No end to it.

Yes,canadians are taxed highly on alcohol and tobacco,with cigs just gone up another .80 cents a pack. Our goods and services tax is 7 percent,(the federal GST) and provincial tax is now 8 percent,up from 7 until last month.
People will still drink and smoke,and they know it! (although it does seem this last jump was enough for many to quit smoking). But you are right,alcohol consumption is on the rise.

The American Mental Health Association says depression will be the number one "disease" by 2010.

The sad part with what our so called "leaders" in this province are doing,is we already have high unemployment. They went back on most election promises,(hey now theres a shocker)..and are raising school tuitions,lowered income assistance(welfare rates), and medical premiums just jumped 50 percent. Oh yea,and they lowered the minimum wage and are threatening to roll back rules with employment standards...somewhere back to where things were in the late 1800's.

Terri,arent you glad you left B.C.? Oh but now you have to miss the "camp-out" on the premieres front yard. Free bus service to the protest and everything!

I must go now and wrap a few gifts for the baby daughter who turns 19 tomorrow. Legal age now,just in time to hit the bars til 4 AM

WriteOn..when you have figured out which
"god" is doing all this, please let me know will ya?!
Want to start an Israel thread?..now theres a truly sad topic. Israel,the US, and England..against the rest of the world. oh Vey.

Oh ladies...the whole Israel mess just breaks my heart.

It's SO worthless!

Dammit! doesn't any one understand that the best way to get rid of your enemies is to Make Them Your Friends!!!!!!!!!!

And Ilana is somewhere over there in that mess all brainwashed to hate........

As I write this...they are shooting their way into The Church of the Nativity......

peace....I just want peace....all over the world....and in my Soul....

What good is it to have the answers...if no one asks you the questions?....What good are knowing the questions...when you never find the answers?

I have complete and totaly faith that God's divine intervention is all over the world....and that it all has reason and purpose

It is proven to me repeatedly thru the many deja vu's...and the wonderful message in the stars....by (Wo)man's humanity to (Wo)man....all the gOOd stuff the news never reports...that goes on daily all over the world.

But some day.....when God and I get to meet again...I'd like to point out...that from here....it REALLY does not look like any one is in charge!

I mean GEEZ...you have to lOOk so hard sometimes...to hang onto that glimmer of faith over fear.

Oh...I know....He'd say "where wast thou when I created the Sun and the universe?"...and I'd answer...."well I was probably planning how pissed I was going to be in 2002...."

Love,

Dani