#162489 - 07/28/08 09:05 PM
Reconciliations with Reincarnation
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Registered: 05/25/02
Posts: 1397
Loc: Here
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I've had dreams lately of cataclysmic disasters... but what interests me the most about the dreams at this moment is the prominent theme of reincarnation in them. In the dreams I (we~ all of us) live on and on. Lovers became my children-- through each life there was a tapestry of connection... but, rather than finding consolation in the revelation of eternal life, I find myself (so far) unexplainably saddened by it. In the dreams, I see tsunamis of enormous scale wiping out millions (?) of people, and although I should be consoled by the dreams also revealment of souls enduring onwards, to live again and again, I'm left with a melancholic longing for the innocent souls that must endure such terror and trauma and all the loved ones I know in this life, lost to me, without me being able to help them. I'm not one at all to be swept up by new-age ramblings of 2012 fatalistic predictions, so these dreams come at me 'out of the blue'. Yet, I've always been an apprentice of dreams and the dream-world, feeling a strong intuition of knowing what is 'just a dream' rather than a prophetic or spiritually meaning dream. These dreams feel very strongly prophetic (I can't explain why--a feeling) and spiritually meaningful. This isn't the first time I've dreamt about reincarnation, but the message seems to become clearer and more prominent over time. I suppose why I'm here typing this out is, I wonder if anyone else has these feelings of discontent with the revelation of reincarnation? Why am I not consoled by it, but rather feeling a bit angry and sad about it? (not that anyone can answer my feelings for me) I mean, we're thrown out here in this 'world' where we're basically entirely vulnerable and bare; learning/loving and everything we come to treasure is wiped away as meaningless in an instant. And on and on we go, surrendering our souls for love, to have it be pulled away and repear again in an almost homeogenic, easily refurbished form. You know? I understand the significance of not clinging and as well, the dreams were also very inspirational as far as understanding how very valueless are man-made structures of society in the grand scale of what's really important, I mean, when you see a wave of water 1,000 feet high coming at you, in that instant, there's a terror indefinable and a perephrial vision that understands there is nothing from horizon to horizon that is meaningful but SOULS (  ) and nothing to do, no where to run, but just take a deep breath, but ...
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Our truest life is when we are in dreams awake.
~ Henry David Thoreau
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#162492 - 07/29/08 01:22 PM
Re: Reconciliations with Reincarnation
[Re: BlueDove]
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Afficionado
Registered: 05/26/00
Posts: 562
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Hey BlueDove,  I, too, have found the revelations of reincarnation to be a major downer, to say the least. It is at once a sobering, and yet, a liberating realization.  I'm always astounded by the majority of folks who proclaim to believe in reincarnation, and yet... they still seem to believe that somehow, someway, we'll be able to "escape" this planet and get to heaven, or Eden, or the garden, or whatever modern religion has labelled it. I've discovered that when many people come to the topic of reincarnation, they get to the "cool factor," and never take their souls beyond into the darkness of what reincarnation actually MEANS. It is one thing to acknowledge that reincarnation is "cool" - that we've all been "someone else" in another lifetime, but I've found that most people have difficulty getting past the fact that IF we are souls which continually reincarnate here on this earth, the theory of a distant, "perfect" heaven - a place we'll all go to when we die - is blown right out of the water! On a personal note, I can relate to your prophetic dreams and the new dawning of realization that we are all here in some manner or form, forever. In fact, I as well have had many dreams of tidal waves, tsunamis, etc., and you're right; the horror that faces a small and fragile human when faced with a wave of water 1000 metres high is life-altering, isn't it? I also experienced hundreds of plane crash dreams for most of my life. (They have since ceased, thankfully.) Some might say they were a precognition of 9/11, as many people experienced these dreams, but I've begun to look at things a little differently. In my own opinion, the dreams weren't really a prophecy of what is happening to us literally, or of what IS to happen to us literally, but a symbol of what is happening to us universally, on a subconscious soul level. For example, "crashing to earth without wings," and being "washed away by the enormity of human emotions and the acceptance of human fragility..."  As a personal example, when I discovered I had existed in other lifetimes, this sobering fact brought home the reality that - if I've been here before, I'll be here AGAIN. And, did I know this last time? Was I aware of it? Did I know I would come back? Would I have done things differently had I known then what I know now? And would it, in the giant scheme of things, make any difference? Several years ago, I was seriously contemplating suicide. And no, I don't think of it as a "mortal sin," as I do not subscribe to the common Christian belief that I would go to "hell" if I chose to do so. However, my "hell" did come in the form of acceptance of what I seen in my past lives and what I knew to be true of this one. What kept me from doing the deed was the HORRIFIC realization that if I left, I would indeed come back. And did I want the memory of suicide leaving an imprint on my soul? I think this is where humanity has lost track of itself. We see reincarnation as a means to explore interesting themes in our lives, spiritually, mentally, emotionally, and physically, but the dark underside of the realization has been ignored. The thought of "forever" is painful to humans. I sometimes think that what humans label "fear of death," is actually our certainty - the inner soul's knowledge, whether acknowledged consciously or not - that REGARDLESS of our wishes and desires of heaven, or the surface fear of a religious-themed "hell," our souls will reincarnate right here, on this earth. And, what are we gonna do about it?  In other words, we WILL die, we WILL be born again, and we WILL live again. In many manners and forms. To accept - TRULY accept, not just live it out as a party game - reincarnation is to accept responsibility for our lives, how we treat others, and most specifically - how we treat this planet. Anyway,  while I still grieve for lifetimes lost, and feel small and anxious when I think of lifetimes to come, what gives me solace is the fact that if I choose to go when Mother Earth deems it is time, I know that I will be a part of the mighty plan, (something I DO believe in) and I have to hold faith that when my time comes, it will be for a good reason. And that, when and where I come back, the life I live at THAT time will be part of the mighty plan, too. I will be living my role in the giant story of humanity.  anessene 
_________________________
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."
- Martin Luther King, Jr.
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#162493 - 07/29/08 11:33 PM
Re: Reconciliations with Reincarnation
[Re: anessene]
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Administrator
Archangel
Registered: 05/06/99
Posts: 6603
Loc: Cripple Creek, Colorado, USA
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I just figure that again and again we'll keep muddling along and hanging on in quiet desperation and all that, and maybe that should make me despair, but at this point, I just figure, "OK, fine." I think that at least - in this lifetime - I have finally gotten past being a drama queen. I have finally learned to tell panic to shut the f up and quit with the histrionics. Of course, that probably means in my next lifetime I'll really get something seriously awful to panic about.   Maria
_________________________
I keep traveling around a bend -- there was no beginning, there is no end. It wasn't born and never dies. There are no edges, there is no size. -- George Harrison
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#162497 - 07/30/08 02:05 PM
Re: Reconciliations with Reincarnation
[Re: WriteOn]
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Veteran
Registered: 05/25/02
Posts: 1397
Loc: Here
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hehe, Maria.  Maybe once we surmount that initial challenge, we can move on to really experiencing 'life'-- as it is purely and beautiful in its present possibilities without all the complicated scenarios we give color to. An ongoing challenge, for sure, so probably one we're due to keep reliving and reTurning from. Anessene  I really appreciate your post. Thanks for sharing as you have. I agree with you that Heaven as well as Hell are right in here; inside of us. And the creation of either a result of our focus; shifting (with our focus) in the corridors of Time. I think its best if I let my thoughts take this all in for a little bit for now. I'd had the thought of how the tsunami might represent other emotional elements (and inner battles for such) I'd been experiencing. Thanks for giving me lots to consider. 
_________________________
Our truest life is when we are in dreams awake.
~ Henry David Thoreau
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#162500 - 07/30/08 05:29 PM
Re: Reconciliations with Reincarnation
[Re: BlueDove]
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Administrator
Archangel
Registered: 05/06/99
Posts: 6603
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A few thoughts to add to the stew ... I don't think "here" is the only "where" there is. In fact, I feel really clearly, and have felt for a long time, that there are other "wheres" to be. After all, there are billions and billions of stars, and we are star dust. And there are souls who have gone on who I visit sometimes in dreams, who I don't feel have reincarnated again here, but who are accessible somewhere out there. I really cherish the time I get to spend with them in dreams, the little human things, the warmth and love, that passes between us, and I'm utterly convinced these visits are real and not just my dreaming mind reworking memories. I also don't think that a recognition of reincarnation negates the existence of a heavenly nirvana state at all, to my way of thinking, because my way of thinking not only allows for multiple wheres, but also because I think that in reality, although our perception here is limited and we see through a glass darkly, in the truth of full perception, even now, we are not only here and we are not only now. If God is eternal, as I believe is true, and we are the children of God, as I believe is true, then I believe it is in our nature to be less bounded by here and now than it currently feels like we are. Regarding dreams, although of someone thankfully still here on Earth with me, I recently dreamt I was somewhere public, where some tough tried to grab ... I don't know, either something of mine that I had with me or maybe it was me he was trying to grab. And I called out for my Dad, who came dashing around the corner as he always does when I need a hand. And so he was grappling with the bad guy, but I quickly became aware that now suddenly instead of me needing my Dad to help me fight off the bad guy, my Dad needed me to help him with the bad guy. And so I immediately rejoined the fray, but still woke up thinking, "Call 911!" Also thinking I wish I weren't so small. In this life at this time, it is of course my time to be the responsible adult, to be taking on the Blue Meanies. But still of course, aware of smallness and calling out for a greater power...  Maria
_________________________
I keep traveling around a bend -- there was no beginning, there is no end. It wasn't born and never dies. There are no edges, there is no size. -- George Harrison
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#162502 - 08/05/08 08:53 PM
Re: Reconciliations with Reincarnation
[Re: BlueDove]
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Old hand
Registered: 10/20/99
Posts: 1039
Loc: Massachusetts, USA
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Go confidently into the direction of your dreams! Live the life you always imagined. ~ Henry David Thoreau ~
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#162619 - 09/19/08 01:11 PM
Re: Reconciliations with Reincarnation
[Re: Venus]
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Veteran
Registered: 05/25/02
Posts: 1397
Loc: Here
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hello Venus... Maria.  Maria, I tend to believe that your encounters are much more than the imaginings of your dreaming mind as well. And the possibilities of other-where's and "times" are vaster than our minds can circumference. Many dreams I believe are Gifts. Gifts of treasure for us to decipher and uncover... even the most traumatic and distressing ones. Especially the ones of such enduring Love as yours.  Venus, I hope I didn't offend with my comment on 2012 ramblings. Surely there was a softer way I could have conveyed what I meant. I also keep an open mind to all I hear on the subject. I recently learned the Cherokee calender also ends at 2012... it's fascinating to think on how these diverse cultures, in distance or time, could have very similiar prophecy. Was my dream a collective connection to the Mayan prophecy? I don't know. I won't presume, but imagine the possibility does exist. Perhaps it was a collection of things all together at once. I'm not sure why I came here with it... only admit the welling emotion of it did disturb me. As well as give me much to consider. I've since had more dreams... ones of Doves and Landscape Visions~ my eyes scanning a future world. I just taking it in in time and wonder. Thanks for sharing this wonder with me.  Love, Lisa
_________________________
Our truest life is when we are in dreams awake.
~ Henry David Thoreau
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#162638 - 09/23/08 07:42 PM
Re: Reconciliations with Reincarnation
[Re: BlueDove]
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Archangel
Registered: 03/01/00
Posts: 3486
Loc: Portland,OR,USA
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Neptune is working over time for sure.  There is only 2 things that can over come all the visions, beliefs, lies, facts, hunches, and sadness. 1. We are alive. Somehow we were born and have the wonder of self awareness. We can think about impossible things. We can move and make machines. There are no rules but ... see #2. 2. The Universe is so hostile as to continuously tear its self to pieces down to the atomic level. So why we are alive, we should allow as many others to live in piece so we and they can continue being alive for as long as our bodies will allow. Where we go or what happens after we die is pure speculation from a brain full of useless information. But that's all we have and none of it is worth dying over.  Darwin But bugs are still not allowed in the house. And I hate cats. 
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#162639 - 09/24/08 02:47 PM
Re: Reconciliations with Reincarnation
[Re: proxymoon]
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Afficionado
Registered: 05/26/00
Posts: 562
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Prox,  Where we go or what happens after we die is pure speculation from a brain full of useless information. But that's all we have and none of it is worth dying over. Dude! 
_________________________
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."
- Martin Luther King, Jr.
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#162662 - 09/29/08 06:11 PM
Re: Reconciliations with Reincarnation
[Re: BlueDove]
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Old hand
Registered: 10/20/99
Posts: 1039
Loc: Massachusetts, USA
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_________________________
Go confidently into the direction of your dreams! Live the life you always imagined. ~ Henry David Thoreau ~
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#162665 - 09/29/08 06:32 PM
Re: Reconciliations with Reincarnation
[Re: Venus]
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Old hand
Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 956
Loc: location location
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 Hi, the site House of Horus I've gone to again and again over the years... and just recently went there to read up on the dream state awareness... So Thoht it might interest some of you if you havn't already been to the site or read this sort of information before, anyone familiar with Dan Winter's writings would recall the words "Bliss" and Bardo state mentioned time and time again would perhaps like to read the concepts more basically here... Taken from Dr. Charles Muses work on The Lion Path for the 21st Century, at his House-of-Horus site, unfortunately Charles Muses born 1919 passed on in 2000, the legacy's still online though... cheers Crazy Daisy  Bardo Jumping Every life-bearing world has its own bardo, and this bardo is a faithful mirror-image or reflection of the nature of that molecular world, whatever the mixture of predatory and symbiotic traits that form the warp and weft of its planetary ecology and life-wave. (See also Types of Worlds ) When people walk the Lion Path they are able to do more than "dream true" in the bardo: they can move from one bardo to that of a different and higher (because more symbiotic) type, from which incarnation on a world with greater love and symbiosis in its environment will ensue. People who learn to jump bardos do not forget all they have experienced and learned in prior incarnations. Instead this wisdom is retained in their transincarnational memories. The kind of world in which one will make one's next incarnation is determined by your soul dream or your highest vision: A full third of all those on earth now walking the planetary Lion Path will reincarnate first on a type-14 or Venus-Sothic world, because their soul dream is to learn how to love more. The therapies of this type of world center on right relationships, or bringing the right pairs together to further their mutual evolution. A further fifth of those on the planetary Path will next reincarnate on a type-15 or Saturn-Sothic world. These people have the soul dream of learning trustworthiness, which means learning how to consistently act in a loving way, as well as feeling it. Type-16 or Sun-Sothic worlds will attract a further 13 1/3rd percent of people on the planetary path, because their soul dream is to more deeply connect with their deepest self-nature (the solar strand of the self) and to manifest that kind of awareness. A further 6 2/3rd percent of these people will reincarnate on a type-17 or Moon-Sothic world. Having already established a strong connection with their higher selves on earth, their soul dream is to develop the lunar strand of the self so that it can maintain a permanent union with the higher self. Type-19 or Mercury-Sothic worlds will attract a further 6 2/3rd percent whose soul dream is to become initiated into great wisdom, even beyond that which they can realize in themselves. They wish to understand the how and the why of everything, even though they do not as yet have the ability to apply much of that knowledge on a practical and skilled level. Still others, who already acquired on earth sufficient wisdom about the nature and purpose of life and our inherent potential to evolve into higher life-forms, will be attracted to still higher type worlds where they can be trained to apply such wisdom in increasingly powerful modes. For example, another 6 2/3rd percent will be attracted to type-20 or Jupiter-Sothic worlds because their soul dream is to learn how to become expert healers of the body. They will be trained as master-physicians and surgeons, learning the use of medicines that have synergistic and complementary side-effects, and how to conduct surgery non-invasively. The 6 2/3rd percent who reincarnate on type-21 or Uranus-Sothic worlds are attracted there because, although they too wish to become healers, their soul dream is to learn how to tackle disease in its psychic origins and how to protect and heal the body through the healing of the mind and memories. Those who have a great love of animals would tend to be drawn to these worlds also, as it is there that humanity learns how to function in complete communication and harmony with the animal life-forms in the biosphere. The final 6 2/3rd percent of people now walking the earth's Lion Path will be drawn to reincarnation in a type-32 or Jupiter pre-pleromic world. These people, being aware that all disease and disharmony ultimately arises from disturbances and imbalances at the deepest level of the soul, desire to learn how to direct healing force to the soul itself. Note that these deep desires or soul dreams can only bring incarnation in a higher type world if one has learned the lessons of all intervening world-types between earth and that specific type. Thus one could not incarnate in a Saturn-Sothic type world unless one had already learned while still on earth how to love enough (the lesson of Venus-Sothic worlds). Bardo Jumping "The Soul is a Circle" Plato
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